Mr. Liviu: How We avoid gaps in the real day between the morning and the afternoon, for example a professor works from 08.00 to 10.00 and is waiting
for evening work from 13.00 to 16.00, how do we make him work from 10.00 to 12.00 and then work in the evening from 13.00 to 1600
This should be possible with the constraint max 0 gaps per real day (enable it first, without worrying about the message).
Please tell me, in your situation, work time is 8-12 and 13-17, with a one hour break in between, and gaps in the timetable in the morning/afternoon are not allowed?
كما قال ليفيو، هنالك قيد يمكن من التقليل من الفجوات بين الصباح و ما بعد الظهر؛ أقصى فجوات في يوم حقيقي للمدرس(كل المدرسين) يمكن مع أقصى فجوات >=0. لكن أعتقد أن القيمة صفر(0) ستجعل الجدول الزمني صعبا أو مستحيلا. من الأفضل التجريب مع قيم أكبر من الصفر ، وفي حالة العثور على جدول زمني بنجاح، يمكن التقليل من أقصى فجوات شيئا فشيا كلما تم الحصول على جدول زمني
Thank you, Mr. Liviu, for your response. In my case, the gaps are not recommended from 10.00 to 12.00 and from 13.00 to 14.00, or from 13.00 to 15.00.
Benahmed: do you think I should consider adding constraints teachers/students max sum of gaps per real days per whole week?
Quote from: dey lyamine on July 26, 2020, 10:09:06 PM
Thank you, Mr. Liviu, for your response. In my case, the gaps are not recommended from 10.00 to 12.00 and from 13.00 to 14.00, or from 13.00 to 15.00.
You are welcome!
Then why can't you use max 0 gaps per real day?
No, I didn't mean that at all. Leaving the constraint as it is currently is best. Strengthening this constraint to work per week will make schedules very very difficult or possibly impossible!
. أنا أحاول على قدر الإمكان التقليل من الفجوات سواء في الصباح أوالمساء ، شكرا جزيل على التوضيح وعلى كل المجهودات التي تبذلها الأستاذ بن أحمد عبد الكريم
Quote from: Benahmed Abdelkrim on July 26, 2020, 10:19:48 PM
No, I didn't mean that at all. Leaving the constraint as it is currently is best. Strengthening this constraint to work per week will make schedules very very difficult or possibly impossible!
I mean to add a new constraint. Now, if the user adds max 1 gap per real day, it can be in each real day (so 5 or 6 in total the whole week, one for each day). But if the user adds max 1 gap per real day and max 2 gaps per real day per week, there can be only 2 in total. It would be a plus. The user can decrease one by one until it is no longer possible.
Quote from: Liviu Lalescu on July 26, 2020, 10:23:03 PM
Quote from: Benahmed Abdelkrim on July 26, 2020, 10:19:48 PM
No, I didn't mean that at all. Leaving the constraint as it is currently is best. Strengthening this constraint to work per week will make schedules very very difficult or possibly impossible!
I mean to add a new constraint. Now, if the user adds max 1 gap per real day, it can be in each real day (so 5 or 6 in total the whole week, one for each day). But if the user adds max 1 gap per real day and max 2 gaps per real day per week, there can be only 2 in total. It would be a plus. The user can decrease one by one until it is no longer possible.
I am not totally agree!
Gaps between morning and afternoon are
essential in half-day schedules.
It is allowed by laws. Perhaps there is a misunderstanding of the importance of gaps by some beginners. It represents
life for schedules and without them, sorry
the timetables becomes impossible.
Mr. Livio, because in Algeria we have a spare hour to receive the guardians, which is between two classes. It can be on any day of the week, morning or evening.
Quote from: Liviu Lalescu on July 26, 2020, 10:23:03 PM
Quote from: Benahmed Abdelkrim on July 26, 2020, 10:19:48 PM
No, I didn't mean that at all. Leaving the constraint as it is currently is best. Strengthening this constraint to work per week will make schedules very very difficult or possibly impossible!
I mean to add a new constraint. Now, if the user adds max 1 gap per real day, it can be in each real day (so 5 or 6 in total the whole week, one for each day). But if the user adds max 1 gap per real day and max 2 gaps per real day per week, there can be only 2 in total. It would be a plus. The user can decrease one by one until it is no longer possible.
In addition, this constraint will be useless, because it will simply make the timetables very difficult, which makes users abandon them...
Benahmed: OK, I see (even if I am not sure you understood me correctly/completely).
Quote from: dey lyamine on July 26, 2020, 10:29:56 PM
Mr. Livio, because in Algeria we have a spare hour to receive the guardians, which is between two classes. It can be on any day of the week, morning or evening.
dey lyamine: Maybe in your case you need to add max 0 gaps per real day, and add this guardians hour as an activity with duration 1. You might even use the official FET, and add only 5 (or 6) days per week, and work with real days (not half days). Please let me know.
Mr. dey lyamine: the constraint teachers max gaps per real day also allows selectable a one day exception of +1 gap.
Thank you very much, Mr. Leviu, for the helpful updates of your program, and I will send you a timeline that I am working on for this season, consisting of 38 educational cohorts and 79 professors, when he finishes his evaluation and comments.
Quote from: Liviu Lalescu on July 26, 2020, 10:43:32 PM
Benahmed: OK, I see (even if I am not sure you understood me correctly/completely).
I understand you very well. FET is very flexible with some constraints we can do almost everything.
another constraint which modulates the gaps between morning and afternoon on
real days and per week. I think this is not a good idea, because a minimum of gaps is very necessary, otherwise the timetables becomes very hard even impossible, you can try with max gaps per real days = 0. FET will get stuck!
Yes, but if you try with max gaps per real day = 1 and max gaps per real day per whole week = 2, it is not so hard (as 0 per real day). It will make 3 days with 0 gaps per real day and 2 days with 1 gap per real day.
But anyway, it might confuse the user.
Quote from: Liviu Lalescu on July 26, 2020, 11:03:35 PM
Yes, but if you try with max gaps per real day = 1 and max gaps per real day per whole week = 2, it is not so hard (as 0 per real day). It will make 3 days with 0 gaps per real day and 2 days with 1 gap per real day.
But anyway, it might confuse the user.
even with 2 gaps per real days and per whole week, this cannot be achieved for all teachers and for all students..maybe for a few teachers and for a few students sets only. so I do not see the usefulness of adding a very limited constraint!
It would be an addition, something in plus, not in minus. It is more relaxed than max 0 gaps per real day. I don't understand why are you so bitter. But I admit it might confuse the users and that it is not really needed now.
I am so Sorry, dear Liviu if I got a little out of context, but I had to explain the importance of the GAPS in the timetables. In addition, the proposed constraint like you said may confuse users and make the timetables very difficult even impossible if they are misused.
I think also, that's best to leave time, especially for beginners, until they understand the importance of GAPS in the timetables.
Thank you very much dear Liviu 🙂
OK, dear Benahmed! :)
i think that such a proposal has been asked for by many FET users as the problem is between 10 to 12 and working in the afternoon the situations worsens when a teachers who does not live in the work place has to wait from 10 am to 15.pm tiring and boring may be if the constraint is adopted it could be applied on the teachers leaving away of school and won"t affect the time table generation as it concerns only a limited number of teachers
Quote from: yahi on July 27, 2020, 09:03:15 PM
i think that such a proposal has been asked for by many FET users as the problem is between 10 to 12 and working in the afternoon the situations worsens when a teachers who does not live in the work place has to wait from 10 am to 15.pm tiring and boring may be if the constraint is adopted it could be applied on the teachers leaving away of school and won"t affect the time table generation as it concerns only a limited number of teachers
I wrote it, but I see I need to repeat it: why can't you use the constraint teachers max gaps per real day?
Benahmed: I got a suggestion from bachiri401 to add what I thought of, teachers/students max gaps per week for real days. I need to consider it; it is only a plus, not a minus, it won't hurt nobody if I will make it.
يمكن الاطلاع على الموضوع المبين في الرابط أدناه، فهو يشرح دور الفجوات في الجداول الزمنية. لقد تم تحيينه الآن ليأخذ في الحسبان القيود الجديدة التي تم إضافتها مؤخرا
https://lalescu.ro/liviu/fet/forum/index.php?topic=4586.msg25503#msg25503
Quote from: Benahmed Abdelkrim on July 27, 2020, 10:12:56 PM
يمكن الاطلاع على الموضوع المبين في الرابط أدناه، فهو يشرح دور الفجوات في الجداول الزمنية. لقد تم تحيينه الآن ليأخذ في الحسبان القيزد الجديدة التي تم إضافتها مؤخرا
https://lalescu.ro/liviu/fet/forum/index.php?topic=4586.msg25503#msg25503
Is this post for me to read? I find this a bit difficult.
bachiri401 said that he uses max 1 gap per real day with 1 day exception of +1, and he would use max 2 gaps per week for real days.
Quote from: Liviu Lalescu on July 27, 2020, 09:50:54 PM
Benahmed: I got a suggestion from bachiri401 to add what I thought of, teachers/students max gaps per week for real days. I need to consider it; it is only a plus, not a minus, it won't hurt nobody if I will make it.
OK. as you like. If you see that this may help, then that's fine :)
thanks!