Messages

Ok, Liviu
When I have the time to do it, I'll prepare some details about my idea and I'll send it to you.
Have a nice day.
Luca

Thank you, Volker

Dear Liviu and Volker,
thank you for your replies.
I totally understand what you said, and I agree: it's a "big stuff"
My primary intention was to create interest in this, and I hope someone skilled can offer his help.
By my part, if I can do something, I'll do (I'm not a real programmer, but I have some little skills), feel free to propose...

In the meantime, when I'll have time to do that, I'll send you some details about my idea, based on statistical calculations and not "observations" of many runs. I repeat, I can only describe behaviours and not write real algorithm, because I haven't all the skills needed, but (who knows) it can be a first little step

I agree also on what you said about financial part, and I hope it can go better in the future, you deserve it (the rows in donation page are really too few ).

By the way, if you have some tool to help me in finding the most critical slots, you are welcome!

Many thanks, really, for your work.

Bye!

I chose this subject because I'm aware that what I'm going to propose is a really huge feature.

In the timetables I have to elaborate, I often have problems related to shortage of first or last hours, expecially on Friday or Monday (caused by teacher's constraints), but I don't have a tool that say me precisely which days/hours are the most critical, so I "expand" constraints quite blindly....
If I see at the most critical activities during the generation I have suggestions on which are the critical student's groups, but they aren't so precise regarding the slot with few or null teacher's availabilities...

I thought a lot on a tools that could help to find why a timetables it's impossible or near impossible: so, in one sentence I'm wondering if it would be possible to calculate the probability that a slot (day+hour: "Monday 8:00-9:00") will be destinated to any student's group?

If I see this problem from far, I would say yes, we "only" need to calculate the probability with which each teacher will occupy this slot (basing on their constraints), combined with all other constraints concerning the Student's group, Subjects, etc.

The algorithm should consider each constraint inserted in dataset, calculate the probability for a slot to be assigned to someone and store it. After that, it will combine all calculated probabilities so to generate a big probability table...

I imagine a multicolor table, with time in horizontal and student's groups in vertical, with light or strong "red" and "green slots based on this probability

There are many cases to examine, but I don't think it's impossible to do, it's "only" (really) time espensive to develop....

In addition, I think it would be possible to "pivot" the data, so to see the probability by teacher (always to occupy that slot), or by other dimensions...

I don't have the skills to do that (and firstly to estime its feasibility), but maybe someone has the possibility to start the project...

It would be possible to test it starting with a first set of constraints considered in calculations, and after enlarge to other constraints typology....

Any ideas / comments are welcome!

I swear, I'm not crazy, it's a serious suggestion :-D

Depending on your dataset there might be an other easy solution:
if teacher A have got 2 activities with a 100% min day constraint and teacher B has 3 activities with a 100% min n day constraint, then you can just put that 5 activities to a min n day constraint (and of course you still need teacher A with max 2 days per week and B with max 3 days per week.)

Hi Volker!
Thank you for your suggestion
In my dataset, "A" has 4 activities and "B" 6 activities. Does your solution work also in this situation (putting all 10 activities in the constraint)? It was the first solution I thought on, but I'm not sure about the result...
Thank you again, have a nice day
Luca

Hi Liviu

Are you a mathematics teacher? 

No, I'm not, but I love math!

There is only one thing remaining: I think using many min days constraints or a customization to consider internally min days constraints might work faster. But it does not matter if you can obtain your solutions in an acceptable time. And it is always better to use the official FET, for me and for you.

Thank you for you offer, I prefere me too to use the official version (by the way and sorry for the O.T.: I use a lot the feature you created last year after some emails with me, now in the official version: "Max span with exception +1" and it's really useful! Thanks again!)

Edit: Also, if the teachers do not have the magic 2 vs 3 working days in a 5 days week, your method does not work?

I think (but I didn't go deeper in it) that it can work only if the sum of the worked days of the two teachers are less than the week duration. Obviously, you'll have to set the "C" duration = to this sum (not less, not more).
Only to explain: I need this because in next days probably the two teachers "A" and "B" will be "fused" in "A", so I'd like to have since now a timetable compliant with this situation. I'm telling you it because you could think that my two colleagues "A" and "B" hate each other and don't want to be at school in the same time (I'm joking!!)

Have a nice day!

Hi Liviu
Thank you for your reply.
My solution worked, so I don't want to further bother you with a custom version.

I only try to be more clear with the explication of my solution, sorry if it wasn't understandable in my last post...

I remember that "A" works 2 days (not more, not less) and "B" 3 days (not more, not less). The week contains 5 days.

1) I created a dummy teacher "C"
2) I added this teacher to all activities of teachers "A" and "B"
3) I impose that teacher "C" works for min 5 days (the sum of the 2 days of "A" and the 3 days of "B"). This constraint forces FET to distribute all the activities of two teachers on 5 days: two of them will be "with" "A" (he can work only 2 days, not 3), the other "with" "B" (he can work only 3 days, not 4) so it won't be any overlapping between their activities. No possibility to have a day with activities of both teachers.... If there is a day with activities of both teachers, it implies that "A" or "B" work 1 day over the limit, or "C" works 1 day below the minimum... and this is impossible ... At least... I think!

I hope to have well explained it, but at the same time I don't wont that you "waste your time" with this question

Your opinion is too important for me, so I reflected a lot on this solution when you told me your doubts... and now I'm less sure than before!!
But so far, it works...  (unless it was only a question of luck, but I don't think so: I generated almost 10 timetables with this solution, all ok)

Have a nice evening!
Thank you

Luca

Dear Liviu, I have another question for you:
is it possible to say to FET that two teachers ("A" and "B") never teach the same day of the other?
For example: if teacher "A" teaches on Monday and Thursday, "B" doesn't teach on these days, etc.

Please note that one has the constraint: 2 min and max day per week, the other 3 min and max days (total days per week in the institute are 5, so no problem)

Right now, I add to the activities of both teachers a third teacher "C", that must work for minimum 5 days, so to "spread" in all 5 days the "A and "B" activities (I use the feature called in italian: "compresenza", I dont' know the english translation...)

the "A" activities become "A"+"C" activities
and "B" activities become "B"+"C" activities

with "A": min/max 2 days
"B" min/max 3 days
"C": min/max 5 days

is there another cleaner way to obtain that?

Thank you!
Best regards

Luca

Thank you
simple and straight solution :-)
It worked

Have a nice day!

Hi all
How can I give to a teacher two free consecutive days, without choose them?
I didn't find solutions by myself...
Many thanks, as usual! :-)
Kind Regards
Luca

The existing feature is what I need, no needs of custom developments!
Thank you for your willingness and sorry again for my initial misunderstanding!

Hi Liviu!
Thank you for your prompt reply!
I'll check it ASAP.

Sorry, but I didn't understand correctly the behaviour of this feature, and I misunderstood the content of the topic I read (...

So, do you confirm that there isn't other possibility to change the initial order, apart of this one, and that the idea about using tags hasn't been developed anymore?

I can understand that the initial order is not so important, but i'd like to give "precedence" to a colleague with few constraints than others, but without fixed slots.

In any case, I'll try go deeper in this feature, so to verify if it's useful for me.
Thank you again

Have a nice sunday

Luca

Hi to all
I need help about the feature "Group selected activities in the initial order", as I don't find anything in the forum, apart of the topic " Modifying the initial order of the activities", in which Liviu announces this new feature and speak about the "put_order##x" new tag.

I need that the Activity "A" is placed before "B", and "B" before all other activities, that must be placed in their "official" order.

To do this, firstly I activated the feature in the Options -> Advanced menu
After that, I tried to use the tag "put_order##1" for "A", and "put_order##2" for "B", and no tags for other activities, but without success.... :-(

Where I'm wrong?
I will really appreciate your help.

I profite also to ask you how can I impose to the program to put an activity AFTER all other activities, placed in their official order (total order of placing: "A", "B", ... all other activities..., "Z")

Thank you to you all, and especially to Liviu and Volker for their great, great work
Ciao

Luca

So I propose you to create a custom version for you, max span per day for teacher has a check box, allow one day with +1 span. If it works correctly, I will think some more on adding it to the official.
Let me know.

Ciao Liviu, sorry of I'm late, in these days I've other problems that keep me away from the timetable (and FET!)...

I'm really interested on this feature, but I don't want create too much work for you.
If you have time, I'll test it with pleasure, if not, I'proceed in some way! :-)

Thank you
Ciao

For other users: do you consider it useful for max hours daily allowing 1 day exception (maybe only for the teachers)?

It would be possible to extend this possibility also to "Max span per day for a teacher" constraint?
I prefere it to "max hours per day" because it includes gaps
Thank you