complex secondary spanish school situation

[silvia]

hi again. I think Bingen can do nicely with the same categories I use, because I suspect he is working with a very similar type of school as I do. I'll contact you by mail and we can check if you can do it with 3 categories. If you do, we'll post the results here so everybody can use the help.

I3 is a subgroup of 1rst ESO, the same as 1A, 1B, 1C, etc
I use 1A-1+1A-2+1B-1+1B2+1C-1+1C2 for catalan, spanish and maths, and then I3 (=instrumental 3) for the diversity group of 1st ESO.
Does it sound more clear now?

[ßingen]

hi again. I think Bingen can do nicely with the same categories I use, because I suspect he is working with a very similar type of school as I do. I'll contact you by mail and we can check if you can do it with 3 categories. If you do, we'll post the results here so everybody can use the help.

I3 is a subgroup of 1rst ESO, the same as 1A, 1B, 1C, etc
I use 1A-1+1A-2+1B-1+1B2+1C-1+1C2 for catalan, spanish and maths, and then I3 (=instrumental 3) for the diversity group of 1st ESO.
Does it sound more clear now?

I think so. Then you are actually using 2 categories only, aren't you? One for "A, B, C, I3" and another for "-1, -2". Is it ok? But then I suppose that in the timetable of, for example, 1ESOA the I3 activities don't appear. It's not a bad option, as you can print a part the I3 timetable, but I was trying to define the diversity group as subgroup of both A and B (we don't have C).
Another difficulty I have is that besides of "hores B" we have more types of divisions, like optative activities, that can be up to 4 subgroups. I suppose I could adapt your method just increasing this category until 4, and using for each activity the number needed, and supposing that pupils in group 1 are always the same, which would not be true, but I think it would work.

Thanks,

  ßingen.

[ßingen]

Maybe it's too late or I've been too long testing with FET, but I think I've messed up myself.

In my last test I have used just one category: for A and B groups. Then I have defined manually the needed subgroups. As I have not defined them as categories, I've avoided the problem of the large amount of subgroups when crossing all possibilities. Some of these subgroups are simultaneously subgroups of A and B.

But now I have two problems:

- In the timetable of group A activities of group B are printed.
- When I try to generate timetables, FET complains of subgroup D having 31 activities and only 30 timeslots, but I've only defined 9 activities (3 subjects of 3 hours each one) for group D. I've created a false timesolt at the end (called "patch") to be able to generate the timetable, but of course I have to delete it.

It seems FET is restricting simultaneity at subgroup level, and that is counting all activities of groups A and B as of the whole subgroup D (which is a mix of pupils of A and B). So it's actually not assigning any activity to the group A and group B at the same time. If this is the case, I don't understand why. D is subgroup of A and B, but of course they don't have to be all together all the time.

I attach the .fet file and the html timetable (see year 2 ESO), in case it's useful for you to help me.

Thank you very much,

  ßingen.

[silvia]

Hi Bingen,
the good thing about FET is that yes, the activities for I3 will be shown in a timetable for 1A. It's very late now but tomorrow I'll try to come back with the exact subdivisions I used. We also have hores B, optatives, diversitat, alternativa a la reli, etc.

[Liviu Lalescu]

You have 12 activities for 2 ESO A, 10 activities for 2 ESO B and 9 activities for 2 ESO D. So 2 ESO 2 has 31 activities in total - which is wrong. Does 2 ESO D need to belong to 2 ESO A and to 2 ESO B?

[silvia]

OK, now I have the time to detail my subcategories.
I used 2 automatic subcategories.
Year 1
Subcategory1: A / B / C / I3
Subcategory2: -1 / -2 / -3 /-4 /-5

Now, I get 1A, 1B and 1C for common subjects like history or common classes of English.
Then I have 1A-1 and 1A-2 doing spanish, 1B-1 and 1B-2 doing Catalan, and 1C-1 and 1C-2 doing math. These 3 classes are at the same time, and also at the same time we have 1I3 (which includes the I3 from the 3 1rs ESO) doing diversity of maths.
All these activities will be 3 hours. Then the same but with A doing catalan, B doing math and C doing spanish, and I3 doing diversity of spanish.

For hores B I do:
1A-1 doing english.
1A-2 doing English
1A-1 doing tecno
1A-2 doing Tecno.

1A-1 english and 1A-2 tecno must have the same starting time, and min 1 day between this activity and the 2 hours of english with the complete group
1A-2 english and 1A-1 tecno same starting time, etc

For optional subjects I do:

5 activities at the same time.
1-1 (everybody from 1r ESO that does this subject, and includes people from A, B and C) in French
1-2 doing PE
1-3 doing biology
1-4 doing history
1-5 doing english

you will get timetables for every subgroup, but these activities will also be included in the general timetable of 1A. You will get something like this:

1A

Monday

8.30: 1A-1 english / 1A-2 Tecno
9:30: 1A history
10:30: 1A-1 French / 1A-2 PE / 1A-3 biology / 1A-4 History / 1A-5 English
12:00: 1A spanish / I3 maths
13:00 1A Tutoria

etc

is this more clear?

[ßingen]

You have 12 activities for 2 ESO A, 10 activities for 2 ESO B and 9 activities for 2 ESO D. So 2 ESO 2 has 31 activities in total - which is wrong. Does 2 ESO D need to belong to 2 ESO A and to 2 ESO B?

Certainly I needed a break. For a moment I thought that first of all FET would consider 2ESOA and 2ESOB completely separated groups (with no intersection), as this is the actual case in my school, and then it would understand that by 2ESOD belongs to 2ESOA and to 2ESOB I meant 2ESOD belongs to the union of 2ESOA and 2ESOB. My everyday routine at the school lead me to think so, but of course it has no sense for FET. I want to apologize for wasting your time which such an error.
Plus, I have to recognize that I'm the maths teacher, so I hope none of my students is reading this thread. ;-)

OK, now I have the time to detail my subcategories.
I used 2 automatic subcategories.
Year 1
Subcategory1: A / B / C / I3
Subcategory2: -1 / -2 / -3 /-4 /-5

Now, I get 1A, 1B and 1C for common subjects like history or common classes of English.
(...)
is this more clear?

Yes, I think so. Now I'm out, but I will try it as soon as I can. I think this configuration will be enough for me. And of course I will post the results.

Thank you very much for your help to all of you!

  ßingen.

[Liviu Lalescu]

Certainly I needed a break. For a moment I thought that first of all FET would consider 2ESOA and 2ESOB completely separated groups (with no intersection), as this is the actual case in my school, and then it would understand that by 2ESOD belongs to 2ESOA and to 2ESOB I meant 2ESOD belongs to the union of 2ESOA and 2ESOB. My everyday routine at the school lead me to think so, but of course it has no sense for FET. I want to apologize for wasting your time which such an error.
Plus, I have to recognize that I'm the maths teacher, so I hope none of my students is reading this thread. ;-)

No problem! FET is not well documented and mistakes are usual.

[Volker Dirr]

i currently think i want to add simultanous activities the the "normal" table, so no "new" like in untis.

hmmm... it is more difficult then i expected.

It's a problem if the activities don't have the same duration.
So i must code several exceptions to care about that and so i can't use a span in that cases (different duration).

let me think some more. In distress i will just code a list of simultanious activities as untis does.

[ßingen]

Hi again,

finally I've been able to place almost everything: 6 years with almost all the needed divisions. The few ones left are because I need some data from my school, which I will receive soon I think. But it seems it won't be a problem. Following Silvia's method everything works right.
Now I must optimize it a little bit to attend teacher's wishes.
And finally there's the display problem left. The gp-untis way of footnote legend is not good, but I don't like neither the way it's displayed in FET when there are 3 or 4 simultaneous activities in a group, because the column of this day becomes too wide. I'm going to have a look the CSS section in order to see if I can improve it a little bit, but it seems there's no easy solution...

Thanks again,

  ßingen.

[silvia]

hey, I have exactely the same problem. I haven't looked at the css file yet, but I suggest that the first one to solve the problem, tell the other one. What do you say? Trato?

[Volker Dirr]

You can:
- hide some elements (maybe hide the activity tags)
- use shortcuts for teacher-, rooms, students- and subjectnames.
- decrease the font size (by css or if i remember correct it was very easy with webbrowser "opera", because it is possible to change fontsize in the printer settings)
-use boardercollapse to element table

[silvia]

ok, I will try all this. The main problem is the columns that are in the HTML file. when 5 subgroups appear in a timetable, these simultaneous activities are displayed in 5 columns. That makes the timetable veeeery wide.  

[Volker Dirr]

you can also try to reduce only the fontsize of that activities (that activities are in "td.detailed" element.
or if you don't need that information at all, then take a "less detailed" timetable and just tell the sudents one time what they have during .
So every students can write his single activity into that cell.

[Volker Dirr]

So just go to the css file and search the td.detailed element and add the last line about font size. Example:

td.detailed {
 border: 1px dashed silver;
 border-bottom: 0;
 border-top: 0;
 font-size: 5px;
}


Please read this to get more information:
http://www.timetabling.de/manual/FET-manual.en.html#id_45