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Hi Volker,

a)
a1- Teachers give to school labs they want to offer
a2- Students choose prefered labs
a3- We give back teachers schedule and students schedule

b) full teacher have 18 hours so 3 labs, 6+6+6
others are support teachers and some times they attend to students needs
so can be variable, teachers with 1 lab only, others 2 labs, others 3, one 4 because we have a teacher at 24 hour contract
the remaining hours, if in excess, are used to assist and help stuff (manually placed)
In FET i make 3 activities each teacher 2+2+2 , 2+2+2 , 2+2+2 or less in the cases indicated above

c) 3 different projects each teacher (no repetition)

I imagined i could prepare theachers schedule skeleton right after "a1" and before "a2".

Because i already know theachers availability,
and i can assume with sufficient accuracy
which laboratories will be chosen by a student with certain aptitudes.
30 hours a week are filled by 5 labs
If i've 10 labs in the same area we can set them overlapped 2 by 2
So 5 are full aviable without overlap.
This would be a manual approach.

But the temptation is to wait "a2" phase

and assuming n=100 labs, generate a 100x100 upper triangular matrix containing the number of students who chose both labs in the pair (lab_i, lab_j) for all n*(n-1)/2 pairs.
Extract a weighted list and insert the weights from 99% downward into FET, allowing it to generate the least overlapping schedule

If not possible with FET, i try to make a PLI model using open solver ( https://opensolver.org/ ) .
I've to solve some modelling challenges, maybe mask teachers availability is not hard, or a choise matrix that distinguish lab1 lab2 lab3, but the gap to change building!??!
This calculation would be fast and with a well weighted objective function it give back most non-overlapping possible followed by the least overlapping.

But before this modelling and implementation effort ... if FET can help ...

We have a project week in dicember where each teacher give 3 workshops/laboratories (6+6+6 hours).
A 6 hours lab is spreaded over the week 2+2+2.


The data we have are:
-35 teachers x 2/3 workshop = about 100 workshops
-300 students that choose a workshop-area and 3 prefered workshop to attend

students have to be covered all the 30 week-hours (5day x 6hours)

So we want to assign them the first and second lab at least + hopefully third (without overlaps) + full the rest with some 2 hours from not overly crowded labs, doesn't matter which one

I think it's best to divide everything into two phases.
The first phase is to create the workshop schedule so that there's minimal overlap between workshops in the same tematic-area.
The second phase is to assign students to the workshops.

My question is this:
If "BaEiTo" can be a solution in the second phase,
in the first phase, is it possible to use FET or a custom version of it to create a workshop schedule that minimize overlaps?

Maybe assigning labs (activities) to same rooms so FET will not overlap them?
Or spamming everything with the "activities are not overlapping" constraint?
(using dummies students just for fill up activities?)

This last approach accept <100% so FET can give me the best without stop because unfeasable (unlike rooms)?
Suggestions?

Thanks you
  Andrea C.

Ciao Pier,
prima di far viaggiare gli insegnanti hai provato a stabilire tot giorni su una sede e tot sull'altra senza fissare i giorni?
In modo che FET abbia più libertà di combinare e trovare soluzioni.
Il nuovo vincolo della versione 7.5.1 permette proprio questo.
Poi magari la situazione è troppo complessa e per qualche insegnante dovrai ammettere scavalchi ma potrai cercare di salvare più situazioni possibili.
Se non sai come fare dimmi che ti dico.

Just add 5 teachers manually before print
So creating activities with fixed time/space that don't involve the generation
Or copying all to excel and adding rows there i guess
Ok i get it

Hello,
now that i have a timetable with subject teachers,
can i use FET interface to place other teachers manually?
(support teachers, enhancement teachers, etc ...)

How do you recommend to proceed from here?

Thanks
Andrea

Potrebbe essere impossibile generare un orario con i blocchi di ore a 2 a 2 per tutti e per tutte le ore.
Lascia una polvere libera.
Chi dice che bastano le spurie dei dispari, le singole e inglese 1+1+1 ?
Italiano 9 ore la dividi in 2+2+2+1+1+1

Tutte le discipline da 2 ore in blocco una volta a settimana, dovete decidere se e quali possono alla peggio essere separate almeno una parte.
Quindi invece di inserirle come blocco da 2 indivisibile le metti come due attività da 1+1 e poi aggiungi un vincolo tempo -> attività -> raggruppate peso 90-99%
Lui le accoppierà quasi sempre tranne se non riesce.

Se gli spezzoni da altre scuole non sono troppo saturi non dovrebbe essere un problema eccessivo, dipende sempre dalla percentuale di insegnanti in questa situazione.

Poi importantissimo rilassa un po' i vincoli dei buchi settimanali e giornalieri.
Inizialmente lascia i buchi settimanali verso 3 o 4 e poi li cali verso 2 gradualmente se completa generazioni.

Così capisci se sono i blocchi il problema, perché da me volevano i blocchi a tutti i costi e ci siamo ritrovati con 8 buchi a settimana.

Poi se uno ti ha chiesto una desiderata gli lasci anche 4 buchi a settimana per iniziare.
Poi in caso tu debba ulteriormente dare respiro alla generazione nell'assegnazione aule per le varie attività se qualche attività la puoi assegnare a più di una aula fallo.
O dai ad un docente un'aula per alcune classi e altra aula per altre classi.
DADA si ma ...
Se vuoi capire la situazione, annulla vincoli aule e genera solo con vincoli di tempo, poi quando completa li rimetti.
Hai messo due edifici ma ne usi solo uno e un'aula è senza edificio, è normale?
Buone prove intanto

Ciao napoli776,
se l'insegnante ROSSI non deve fare più di 2 ore in 3A

da menù:
tempo->attività->altri(1) -> "Un insieme di attività occupa un numero massimo di ore da una selezione"

Aggiungi - Filtra per ROSSI + 3A - Permi "tutte"
Poi in alto apri Ore e selezioni tutto il lunedì e premi aggiungi vincolo

Quindi deselezioni lunedì e selezioni tutto martedì e aggiungi vincolo

Avanti così fino a venerdì

5 vincoli per ogni coppia Insegnante-Classe se hai 5 giorni nel calendario altrimenti 6

Etc ... per tutte le coppie in cui hai queste multiple discipline

Io non ho questo problema perché ho utilizzato un unico blocco di attività per ogni coppia INSEGNANTE-CLASSE

Poi decide il docente come suddividere le sue ore.

Nel modo usato da me basta utilizzare la spaziatura nei giorni delle sub-attività senza preoccuparsi di gestire le discipline che invece tu hai separato.

Ma va benissimo come stai facendo.

Se però poi devi aggiungere tanti vincoli per ogni attività INSEGNANTE-CLASSE allora una le chiavi (TAG) e poi filtri con quel TAG che alla fine è un modo potente e flessibile per etichettare gruppi di attività e poi vincolare chiamando la chiave invece di selezionare a mano coi filtri

Ciao henozzo,
fet a parte descrivi un po' la situazione,
cosa sei arrivato a inserire,
che impostazione volete dare all'orario ... blocchi di ore a coppie più possibile ...
aule in buon numero o limitate ...
risorse condivise ...
al momento non ho visto il tuo fet ma fai capire...
hai messo i vincoli e non trova nulla o non sai come metterli?
Andrea

Ah ok, grouped by what every user needs?
Should be subject/building/teaching area ...
I never had more than 30 teachers but in hight school they are 200/250 ...

Hello Liviu!

I tried the new constraint "A set of activities occupies max sets time slots from selection" this morning.

If i select all 5 days of my week (1,2,3,4,5) tot 5-sets
all work fine (3-4 timetables only so i'm not 100% sure but multiple generate timetables consistent like expected).

But when i used a subset of the week (1,2,3) for tuesday-wednesday-thursday some of timetables started to break the constraint

I send to you .fet by email with datails.

Andrea

In the interface what do you have in mind?
In the time/space constraints at the Teachers voice
Now "A Teacher" + "All Teachers"
Later "A Teacher" + "A set of Teachers" + "All Teachers"
Or like activities all mixed inside "A Teacher has ..." + "A set of Teachers has ..."

Are you thinking to the activity logic like, a tag system for teachers too?

It would be great to have a constraint like this.

I don't understand when you say

activities occupy max (1 or 2) sets of time slots from selection

You mean a static selection or a quantity of time not referred to a precise slots, that the algoritm can move where is better to place it?
In my mind are specific activities that we want to place all together in one or two days without fix the days.
By now i had to fix a day for the far building and this limit the algoritm freedom to find unvisible solutions (the beauty of NP-Hard problems and PLI)

This new constraint appear to me similar to the "max days per week for a teacher" is not?
Where teacher become activity tag and we can select a subset of the week.


For the second part, you're right; I had inverted the selection.
Would it be difficult replace the X with a ✓ and invert red and green in this kind of selections? (Just for a more intuitive interface, not necessary indeed)

I'm wondering if matematically 2) is the dual of 1)
1) can be: fix some free day and let the others to be accoupied until a bound
2) can be: fix some accoupied day and let the others to be free until a bound
funny

Thanks you Liviu!!

Hi Liviu,
the second suggestion is excellent,
but it doesn't seem to work,
in multiple generations,
with two constraints for a teacher
100% 2 hours Monday + 100% 2 hours Friday
often the day off falls on Monday or Friday anyway

So i swith on the workaround again ...
- activity prefered time from selection (monday and friday) about 40%-60%
that slow down very much the algoritm

Hello!

Is there a way to work with days flexibly?
For example, I have many constraints like "max days for an activity (teacher/tag) from a day selection"
(In my case, I will tag all activities of a teacher in a building to constrain him to go to the far building only one or two days, but letting the program decide which ones)
And the opposite constraint to assign one or more free days within a specific set of days.
For example, I want the free day not to fall on Monday or Friday.
So
"min empty days from a day selection"
(in my case, a free day, on Tuesday, Wednesday, or Thursday)

Thaks you
Andrea

So by the fact it's not possible to mix home rooms and prefered rooms together when referred to the same activity, i switch to "activity tag" and "tag prefered room" like Youssef said.
(Eliminating every other room constraint (teacher/subject/class))

Now work perfectly generating extremely good timetables.
It's a mine private experiment by now, my school use a commercial software, and the timetable is awful.
Another planet...
But maybe who use the software at school is not experienced enough.