Important : Two teachers at the same Class

[sstt2]

Hi
how are you brother ?

btw ,i'm working to make .Net versionof your great FET
i find it so easy after your last help
thanks alot

i want to know ( how to do ) problem
i can't find it with myself  

i have :
Student Class( C1 )
Teachers ( T1, T2)
Subjects (S1, S2)

Teacher 1 Gives Class 1 4 Periods with Subject 1
Activity 1 ( T1 + C1 + S1 )
Activity 2 ( T1 + C1 + S1 )
Activity 3 ( T1 + C1 + S1 )
Activity 4 ( T1 + C1 + S1 )

Teacher 2 Gives Class 1 4 Periods with Subject 2
Activity 5 ( T2 + C1 + S2 )
Activity 6 ( T2 + C1 + S2 )
Activity 7 ( T2 + C1 + S2 )
Activity 8 ( T2 + C1 + S2 )

I want to start Two activities at the same time for the same students
in other words, i there will be two teachers at the same time at the same class
when i used (Constraint Activities Same StartingTime)  (Activities must have the same starting time) and select (Activity 1) with the (Activity 5)

I get this Warning

The 1st Warning

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FET warning
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Time constraint
Activities must have the same starting time
Weight (percentage)=100%
Number of activities=2
Activity with id=106201 ( T: Teacher1 , S: Subject1 , St: 1/4 )
Activity with id=107801 ( T: Teacher2 , S: Subject2 , St: 1/4 )

The constraint is impossible to respect, because there are the activities with id-s 106201 and 107801 which conflict one with another, because they have common students sets or teachers or must be not overlapping. The weight of this constraint is 100.0%, so your timetable is impossible. Please correct this constraint.
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Skip rest   See next  
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After this Warning another one comes up

The 2nd Warning

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FET warning
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You have a set of impossible constraints activities same starting time, considering all the indirect links between activities same starting time constraints

The activities with ids 106201 and 107801 must be simultaneous (request determined indirectly), but they have common teachers and/or students sets or must be not overlapping
---------------------------
Skip rest   See next  
---------------------------


i find that i cant define the same starting time for the same students as i understand

the problem now is that we realy want to share period with 2 activities for the same students !!

[Chafik Graiguer]

Hi sstt2 !
You are tryig to do an IMPOSSIBLE task
you are trying to make classe C1 present a the same time in two places !!
This is impossible ! you cant be present  simultaneously at room1 and room2 in the same time

Fortunately , the fix is easy
you need to create two subgroups
You have to define those subgroups from Data ---> students --> Subgroups
Classe C1 should be splitted into two subgroups: C1_1 and C1_2

Activities should be defined as follow:

Teacher 1 Gives Class C1_1 4 Periods with Subject 1
Activity 1 ( T1 + C1_1 + S1 )
Activity 2 ( T1 + C1_1 + S1 )
Activity 3 ( T1 + C1_1 + S1 )
Activity 4 ( T1 + C1_1 + S1 )

Teacher 2 Gives Class C1_2 4 Periods with Subject 2
Activity 5 ( T2 + C1_2 + S2 )
Activity 6 ( T2 + C1_2 + S2 )
Activity 7 ( T2 + C1_2 + S2 )
Activity 8 ( T2 + C1_2 + S2 )

Now shoose Activity 1 and activity 5 , and set:
A set of activiites have same strarting time (day+hour)

the same for:
- Activity 2 and activity 6
-Activity 3 and activity 7
- Activity 4 and activity 8

and you are done

[sstt2]

Thaaaaaaaaaaaaanks for your reply
it sounds to be great and will work
let me test and give you feed back

the main idea is that i want to make two teachers share the same students group at the same period(day + time)
some schools use this to teach the students two subjects at the same time (for example : Math in English , and Math in Arabic )

thanks

[sstt2]

sorryyyyy
but it didn't work
and when i think again at this idea i find that you misunderstand me

i don't want to make the same ( teacher ) to be present  simultaneously at room1 and room2 in the same time

but i want to make two teachers ( teacher1 ) + ( teacher2 ) to be start selected activities for each one of them at the same time ( day + time ) for the same (subgroup)

so,the final result will be some thing like this :


# Subgroup1 Timetable #

     period1   period2   period3   period4  

day1   T1         T2        T3        T4

day2   T3         T1        T5        T2

day3  T1 + T2     T3        T5        T4

===================

as you see
(subgroup1) has mor than teacher
every teacher has his own period
but at (day3) ( period1) teacher ( T1 ) share teacher ( T2 ) the same students subgroup

by the way

i mean by the word ( class ) >>>> the students subgroup Not the Room

any ideas ?

[Liviu Lalescu]

Add an activity with 2 teachers and the students set.

[sstt2]

Great idea but this way i will treat this activity as new one
and i dont want this
my idea in other words is

We have one sub group ( SG1 )
we have two teachers ( T1, T2)
each teacher has his ( own ) subject , not the same subject for all of them
each one of them has 4 activities for subgroup ( SG1 )
T1 works his own 4 activities at different days ( each activity at one day )
T2 also works his own 4 activities at different days ( each activity at one day )

we want for example to make the 3rd activity for T1 and the 3rd activity for T2 to be at the same day !!

>>> this Ok, I can do this ,I can force this activities to have the same day by useing ( Constraint Activity Preferred StartingTime )
>>> or by make them ( ordered , gouped )

But the problem not that
the problem is that i want the 3rd activity for T1 and the 3rd activity for T2 to be at the same day and the same time
and they will teach for this subgroup together

if i used ( Liviu Lalescu ) Idea ( Add an activity with 2 teachers and the students set. )

it wont work fine
we will face other problems

1- if i added an activity with 2 teachers for the same Subgroup, then i must select the same subject for them
2- if i added the shared activity as stand alone activity and not a part of the 4 activities , it may come at the same day with one of the rest 3 activities


the main Question is :

How to force Two activities for the same subgroup to start at the same time even if it was for different teachers and different subjects ?

[Chafik Graiguer]

Well
If each teacher has his own (home) room, if you have enough rooms, you can simply apply Liviu's idea

Back to my idea
I dont understand why

teacher ( T1 ) share teacher ( T2 ) the same students subgroup

Teacher T2 never teaches subgroup 1
likewise teacher T1 never teaches subgroup 2

So please re-enter data correctly
Dont put teacher T1 with subgroup2, and dont put teacher T2 with subgroup1 !
Teacher T1 has the following activities:
Activity 1 ( T1 + subhroup1 + S1 )
Activity 2 ( T1 + subhroup1 + S1 )
Activity 3 ( T1 + subhroup1 + S1 )
Activity 4 ( T1 + subhroup1 + S1 )
As you may notice, teacher T1 has nothing to do with subgroup2 !!

While teachet T2 has the following activities:
Activity 5 ( T2 + subhroup2 + S2 )
Activity 6 ( T2 + subhroup2 + S2 )
Activity 7 ( T2 + subhroup2 + S2 )
Activity 48 ( T2 + subhroup2 + S2 )
Again, as you may notice, teacher T2 has nothign to do with subgroup1
So teacher T1 and teacher T2 cant share same subgroup

A word about subgroup
suppose classe C1 has follownig stdents:
- Ahmed
- Jean
- Reda
- Jeseph

we can define two subgroups
subgroup1 include
Ahmed and Jean

subgroup2 includes Read and Joseph

[sstt2]

Ok brothere
again i cant decripe my problem  

actualy:

T1 teach subgroup1
T2 teach subgroup1 also

this is my data

Teacher T1 has the following activities:
Activity 1 ( T1 + Subgroup1 + math)
Activity 2 ( T1 + Subgroup1 + math)
Activity 3 ( T1 + Subgroup1 + math)
Activity 4 ( T1 + Subgroup1 + math)

teacher T2 has the following activities:
Activity 5 ( T1 + Subgroup1 + Science)
Activity 6 ( T1 + Subgroup1 + Science)
Activity 7 ( T1 + Subgroup1 + Science)
Activity 8 ( T1 + Subgroup1 + Science)


I want ( Teacher T1 ) to meet ( Teacher T2 ) for ( Subgroup1 )  at ( T1 "Activity 1" ) and (T2 "Activity 5")

got it ?

see also my last reply

[Liviu Lalescu]

So, you have an activity split into 4 (A1, A2, A3, A4) and another split into 4 (A5, A6, A7, A8). A1, A2, A4 -> (T1, Su1, St1), A5, A6, A8 -> (T2, Su2, St1), A3, A7 -> (T1, T2, Su1, Su2, St1).

Modify SUBactivities -> modify A3 and A7, add for A3 -> T1, Su1, St1 and for A7-> T2, Su2, no students. Add then constraint activities same starting time (A3, A7).

Unfortunaly, in students timetable, you have no indication that they have also hours with T2. But you can choose in Setting->print activities with same starting times.

[Chafik Graiguer]

I think I understand now
You want Teacher T1 and teacher T2 to meet classe C1 into a single room to teach them two differents subjects
If so, the first Liviu's idea will do it for you

if i used ( Liviu Lalescu ) Idea ( Add an activity with 2 teachers and the students set. )

it wont work fine
we will face other problems

1- if i added an activity with 2 teachers for the same Subgroup, then i must select the same subject for them

This is not really a big problem
it is rather a "cosmetic" problem
you can define a unique subject like that "math/science"
when it come to publish timetable, students will easily understand that this is a mixed subject including math + science !!!

By the way, the most accurate term for your case is Group, not Subgroup
class C1 is a group not a subgroup !!!
you dont need any subgroup

[sstt2]

alfaromeo : Thanks for your help ,your idea is fine

Liviu Lalescu : simply, you are so smart   [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

your idea is the best, it is exactly what i want and what i was searching for

i tested it and worked greaaaaaaaaat [smiley=vrolijk_26.gif]


thanks for all of you